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This essay will deal with the dynamics of potential bullet over-penetration in normal civilian settings as opposed to war-time settings. It is meant to open your mind to all sides of the discussion regarding over-penetration in “carry” guns. It offers no definitive answers, but offers open minded, clear thinking.

In most police department shootings, around 80% of shots fired at humans, miss the human target and that means the bullet is going to head in the direction it was fired, until its kinetic energy is expended one-way-or-the-other. In civilian self-defense shootings, a similar percentage of shots fired miss the human target. Considering this, why are we so worried about over-penetration of the 20% of shots fired that actually hit the human target, when the much greater percentage of shots fired miss the human target and continue on? I am NOT saying that bullet over-penetration should be of no concern, but I am suggesting that we have turned that issue into something much bigger than reality says it is.  A missed shot that hits an innocent bystander will land us and the poor bystander in as much trouble as a bullet that over-penetrated the human target and hit a bystander, right? In fact, there is the likelihood that the bullet that struck the intended human target and spent most of its energy on that target, would not have nearly the momentum remaining to continue on to do as much harm for as great a distance as the bullet that missed its target altogether and has retained its energy!

None of us want to be involved in the shooting of another human, but if the situation we find ourselves in, dictates that we must shoot another human to save innocent lives, we may find ourselves needing a bullet that will penetrate heavy winter clothing, stick frame walls, car doors, windshields or whatever soft cover our threat may have jumped behind for the moment. My carry pistols for public/urban carry, generally have an expanding bullet in the chamber and maybe one more, first up, in the magazine, but all the remaining ammo in the magazine will utilize non-expanding bullets so that I can shoot through some types of soft cover………for decades African hunters have used a “soft” (expanding bullets) for their first shot, but all the remaining ammo in their rifle feature “solids” that will not mushroom and will give extreme penetration under a variety of angles and conditions. Consider that your day is already going so badly you end up in a gun fight…….do you really want ammo that will not penetrate deeply enough to get the job done on any shot other than a “frontal” on an averaged sized or smaller person, that is not wearing winter clothing?

If we knew ahead of time that our upcoming gun fight would be against a man that faces us frontally, stands still, is by himself, in daylight, weighs under 150 lbs., is wearing only a tee shirt and he will not jump behind cover, we could get by with using only expanding ammo that will never over-penetrate a human torso, but the reality is that we need to be prepared for the worst case scenario, which is why we carry firearms in the first place.

All ammo choices will involve some sort of trade-off or compromise. The key is to think through the possibilities of a gun fight ahead of time and choose ammo that will work for the conditions under which you “carry”.

All gun fights will involve considerable risk, which is why we should avoid them to the best of our ability, but if we are forced to shoot, we need ammunition that will cover a wide range of needs and conditions, which means under some circumstances, the bullet may over-penetrate a small, frontal, lightly clad human target, but under other circumstances, (a bigger bad guy at a bad angle wearing heavy clothes, etc.) it may not get the job done unless it is capable of extreme penetration.

Gun fights are sloppy tragic propositions and if you find yourself in one, you will have already had a bad day, but if you are prepared and cool headed, you may save your life and/or the lives of many innocent people. Make smart ammo choices part of your preparedness. Only you can choose what your particular parameters are.

Good shooting and God bless,

Friends and Customers, 08-18-20


All shooters are being inconvenienced with what is happening to our society and the rush it is causing on ammo supplies. We have LOTS of ammo in stock and are making more at a huge volume on a daily basis. If our web site allows you to order any item, that means it is in stock—WE DO NOT TAKE ORDERS FOR ITEMS WE DO NOT HAVE! So, please do not email and ask if items are in stock. If they aren’t, the shopping cart will not take your order.

We have hundreds of customers to get orders to on a daily basis. In order for us to accomplish this for our customers, we ask the following.

  1. Be sure of what you are ordering. You are going to get what you ordered.

  2. Do not contact us and ask to change an order you’ve already placed. When we manually change orders it requires a lot of time that we do not have during this rush and it keeps us from serving all of our customers. If you’d like to change an order, we can no longer do that till things slow down, so simply place another order for more product, but PLEASE, NO MORE CHANGES after the fact!

  3. We NEVER have and never will take ammo exchanges or returns and then turn around and re-sale that ammo to unsuspecting customers as factory new ammo—this is not safe nor is it fair to customers who are buying what they think is new and safe ammo. No ammo is tamper proof! So please stop asking to exchange or get a refund for ammo you ordered, but have changed your mind about.

  4. Please do not contact us and ask for tracking numbers or “when will my ammo ship”? Our system automatically emails out tracking numbers on the orders we ship each day, however, because these emails are coming from a corporation shopping cart, many of these emails may go to your spam folder……..please look there. If it is not in your spam folder, that means we have not yet shipped. At current order rates, we are shipping within 5-7 business days of the time an internet order is placed. Please sit tight. Your ammo will arrive at the same time if you track it or not and will certainly arrive later if we are swamped answering questions instead of getting orders shipped. When 30-50 people per day send emails asking for tracking information and we have to pull that information up, then type it out and email it, it takes a huge portion of our work day that we should be using to ship those orders to customers in need. Please leave us alone so we can serve all of you. (ship to you) It’s a bit selfish, during times of shortages, when so many folks need to protect their families, to slow us down because you ordered carelessly or want to change your order. Right now, we expect you to do your part to help us all get the ammo we need in our troubled country.

These measures are hopefully temporary and will not be needed for long as we enjoy the interaction with our customers, so please, for the time being, be mindful of all those others who are also trying to get ammo during what I think is a societal meltdown/emergency. Hopefully, we can serve you all. We want you and your families to be armed and safe and we wish you the best during these trying times. My biggest concern is that things will worsen yet more, for a while. Until things straighten out in our government and society, we will have to streamline our customer service in order to serve all customers. Thank you for your understanding.

Good shooting and God bless,

Tim Sundles

I Understand